CANADA Health care Crisis

[HONDO74]

From the BBC
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-62716710

Canada is one of the richest countries in the world. Its universal publicly funded healthcare system has been touted by progressive politicians in the US, the country's southern neighbour, who see it as a needed alternative to an American system where millions remain uninsured.

But in recent months, Canada's system has been described by workers and hospital executives as being in a state of "crisis".

That includes struggling emergency rooms.

Toronto ER physician Dr Raghu Venugopal said he has seen stretchers lining the hallways, occupied by patients suffering from ailments like a broken hip or abdominal pains.

On some days, those patients may wait anywhere from two to four days to be admitted to hospital, all while a team of two nurses tends to a total of 50 to 60 patients on the unit.

Other patients are being examined in the waiting room because the lack of staff has forced parts of the ER to close, meaning there is limited space for doctors to see them privately.

"We are in a standard-less void where anything goes, and it is shocking," Dr Venugopal said.

In the prairie province of Saskatchewan, one nurse said some paramedics have spent the entirety of their 12-hour shift waiting with a patient on a stretcher as no one was around to admit them for treatment, leaving the paramedic unavailable to respond to other calls.

Patient stories have also emerged across the country.

[ScaleCraft]

Doesn't surprise me. During the great Pelosi/Obama debacle where we had to pass the bill to see what's in it, and all the hand wringing over how great socialized medicine was in all these other countries, including Canada, we'd have train meets where a dozen Canadians had convoyed down, and were staying for a bit. Asked them why, they told us they needed cardiac work, joint replacements, cancer treatments......and if they let Canada Health do it, the delay to get in to see a Doctor and get treatment meant they would die before they got enough treatment to live.
One or two, I'd pass off as a "vast, right-wing conspiracy" except it was dozens and dozens, maybe hundreds, spread out over several years.
If you know any Australians, ask them how it works there.
It is a real eye-opener. Makes the VA look efficient.

[robert.]

No better in Slovakia. You’ll wait all day to see a doctor. No appointments just wait in line. Once and a while a gypsy will show up and walk right into the examination room. Cut in front of 40 people waiting. It’s something to see. Nobody says a word. Only plus is most meds are over the counter. You can walk into a pharmacy and get what you need. Their pharmacist acts as a GP. When it comes to colds and flu.

[Rufus T. Firefly]

Good luck at getting in to actually seeing a doc in just about anywhere - maybe worrying about the US and our own healthcare system(s) would be a better application of your time. I can't get in to see my doc in less than 6 months time; waste of time going to the ER if it's something serious like kidney stones or a heart attack - you have to go to an Urgent Care facility and cross your fingers. This was all supposed to be fixed 4 years ago......healthcare is hard. Right.....the clueless fixing what they guys paying them off to maintain as is - yup, that'll get fixed.

[robert.]

Rufus, that’s some interesting points. We still have doctors that will only do telemedicine. No office appointments. If you need something other than a script. They send you to urgent care. Doylestown health had purchased or taken over almost every general practitioner in the area. They only doctors with office visits are dentists, dermatologist and ear eyes nose & throat.(not sure what they are called) it will be interesting tii ok see what happens to the price of hearing aid prices

[Rufus T. Firefly]

They only doctors with office visits are dentists, dermatologist and ear eyes nose & throat.

Add our eye doc....but it's 6-9 months to get an appointment with him. I have to set that up so I can get my retinas checked over. Dentist is also available, sadly........got to get a crown done.

[robert.]

You can get your eyes check at walmart No appointment needed. There is an ophthalmologist in their front area. They have a few different stores inside walmart.

[Rufus T. Firefly]

You can get your eyes check at walmart No appointment needed. There is an ophthalmologist in their front area. They have a few different stores inside walmart.

I get a full retina exam from a surgical ophthalmologist , not a regular eye check. Once you've had a detached retina and had it surgically rebuilt, you do not go to Walmart to get your eyes checked.

[Mitch]

I got new eyeglasses last October at the VA. I'm still wearin' my 8 year old glasses 'cause I can't see worth a crap out of the new ones. The VAs frame selection is junk, and I didn't like the optometrist's attitude at all; it was like I was interrupting her day for being there. The glasses don't fit and the frames are such that you can't bend the ear or nose pieces to make them fit. My old eyeglasses are tri-focal, but with the new ones, I can't even make out the gauges on the dash of my truck. Glad I didn't have to pay for those glasses or I'd really be pissed. Problem is, when on SS, layin' out $650 for a decent doctor and a pair of glasses is not in the cards. The good news: I can get an appointment at the VA optical right away.

[Rufus T. Firefly]

..... layin' out $650 for a decent doctor and a pair of glasses is not in the cards.

When it come to your vision, it's hard to go 2nd or 3rd rate, but a little shopping around can pay off.

Last pair of glasses - new lenses and new frames - I bought was through Costco. Under $100 total. Perfect fit and not a complaint - probably the best deal I've ever had on glasses in over 50 years.

[robert.]

..... layin' out $650 for a decent doctor and a pair of glasses is not in the cards.

When it come to your vision, it's hard to go 2nd or 3rd rate, but a little shopping around can pay off.

Last pair of glasses - new lenses and new frames - I bought was through Costco. Under $100 total. Perfect fit and not a complaint - probably the best deal I've ever had on glasses in over 50 years.

My walmart doctor told me to "go to costco for your glasses. They're cheaper." f i had insurance i probably would have sold me a pair.

[Rufus T. Firefly]

..... layin' out $650 for a decent doctor and a pair of glasses is not in the cards.

When it come to your vision, it's hard to go 2nd or 3rd rate, but a little shopping around can pay off.

Last pair of glasses - new lenses and new frames - I bought was through Costco. Under $100 total. Perfect fit and not a complaint - probably the best deal I've ever had on glasses in over 50 years.

My walmart doctor told me to "go to costco for your glasses. They're cheaper." f i had insurance i probably would have sold me a pair.

My lenses alone used to cost me $400-600; if I needed frames figure another $400; insurance did not cover any of it, but seeing is sort of important.....

Now I get lenses and frames for under $100 through Costco. Just a wee bit of profit margin and no gouging at all. Maybe healthcare isn't that hard.

[robert.]

That’s why I mentioned hearing aids. People no longer need a script to buy them. Will prices go up or down?

[Neil]

Countries with primarily conservative governments over the last 20 plus years have neglected healthcare. Canada, particularly Ontario. The NHS in the UK. The United States. Healthcare is expensive and training enough doctors, nurses and laboratory technologists takes time and money. Because of the perverse incentives in the health care systems we have not enough primary care docs. Most of these nations (US, UK) have created huge bureaucracies who are unproductive, actively subvert health care delivery and suck up huge amounts of money. Welcome to the administrative state and governments mainly concerned with reducing taxes and actual delivery of services. Lots of people to blame, but dysfunctional conservative economic theories have played a significant role in the USA and UK. We need to spend more money on healthcare in the UK and Canada, and less on administration and thwarting healthcare in the USA. Our administrative costs are twice or more what they are in other developed countries, which is why we get less actual healthcare for our buck. The fact is that the private and not for profit health care entities, insurance companies, provide no useful function, and don't even exist in most of the developed world.

[Rufus T. Firefly]

Healthcare is expensive and training enough doctors, nurses and laboratory technologists takes time and money. Because of the perverse incentives in the health care systems we have not enough primary care docs. Most of these nations (US, UK) have created huge bureaucracies who are unproductive, actively subvert health care delivery and suck up huge amounts of money. Welcome to the administrative state and governments mainly concerned with reducing taxes and actual delivery of services.

And changing bureaucracies is nigh on impossible once entrenched; ==> "The motives of bureaucracy are opposed to adapting to change."